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EVNT: From Star Franchisee To Franchisor w Asad Hamir @ British & International Franchise Exhibition

Asad Hamir


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EVNT: From Star Franchisee To Franchisor w Asad Hamir @ British & International Franchise Exhibition

Asad Hamir



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About Asad Hamir

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Enjoy this podcast recording from the British and International Franchise Exhibition with Asad Hamir who went from star franchisee to franchisor.

Franchise Exhibitions

Asad Hamir




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Asad Hamir Full Transcript

Amardeep Parmar: [00:00:00] Okay, so welcome everybody. So today is the first ever podcast of the BAE HQ of a Live audience. We're at the Kensington Olympia at the British and International Franchise Exhibition. It's a long name to remember and I got it right and she can cheer and get the background there. And today I've got with me Asad Hamir.

Amardeep Parmar: Who was a franchisee when he was younger and built up an OTU franchisee to several stores and did very well, was a star franchisee. And now he's going the other side of the table and becoming a franchisor. So Asad, can you tell us what made you get into franchising in the first place? 

Asad Hamir: Yeah, so, um, so a bit of my, bit of my story.

Asad Hamir: I'm actually a qualified optometrist by trade. I did optometry at university. My dad was a, IT engineer. So I always had tech around the house. And, um, so I, as much as I, I love, love glasses, you always see me in different types of glasses. Um, in my third year university, Steve Jobs got up on stage and said, here's iPhone.[00:01:00] 

Asad Hamir: And um, at that point I was like, I'm, I'm going to leave the optometry industry and I went into telecom. So I was 20, 22 years old. Um, and, um, at that point I had no business experience. No one in the family really had any real business experience of scaling a business and things like that. And I saw franchising as a way that I could actually get into the business arena, learn, you know, see the operations, uh, all that kind of stuff is figured out.

Asad Hamir: Uh, it was an amazing brand that had the exclusivity on the iPhone at the time, which was O2 back in the day, if everyone remembers. And, um, yeah, like jumped at the opportunity. I still remember going to my interview, uh, hadn't slept the night before I wrote 100 page business plan, slammed it on the table and the lady was like, Oh my God.

Asad Hamir: Um, it was great. Like, um. You know, like going into that with no experience of going through that, not even like, to be honest, having had many interviews, um, I guess growing up, I always had a business acumen, always had an entrepreneurial acumen. So I used to buy and sell things, um, webs, make, make websites, sell computers, all kinds of stuff.[00:02:00] 

Asad Hamir: Um, but I knew this product I could sell. I knew that the iPhone was following all the blogs and all that kind of stuff. So for me, it was like, look, I can learn how to become a business person through franchising. And, um, yeah, opened our first store, uh, I was in Tottenham Hale, uh, Northwest London. And, um, yeah, and then I guess on that journey, that kind of kickstarted it.

Asad Hamir: Um, I've been, I'm still a franchisee of O2 as well. Um, and I grew that to about 16, 17 stores over the years, but amazing journey. Like I, I'd highly recommend anyone that's starting out like and wants to learn the ropes. I mean, the beauty of a franchise business like O2, they have a tried and tested model.

Asad Hamir: You know, they had a tried and tested operations manual. You can go in day one. They can show you exactly how to run your business, how to trade successfully. Ultimately, it's still down to you as the entrepreneur to really drive it. But yeah, that's how I started. 

Amardeep Parmar: Yeah. So one thing as well, like in the last 10 minutes or so, we're going to be taking questions from the audience.

Amardeep Parmar: So have a think about questions as well, and [00:03:00] it'll be in the podcast recording as well. So you can go and see yourself and hear yourself in the podcast too. Looking at that journey at O2, when you initially started out, obviously you didn't know anything, right? Like how did you get going and what were the mistakes you made right at the beginning that you think made you a better franchisee later on?

Asad Hamir: I still remember I didn't know about VAT. So I remember my first tax return, I'd spent all my money on the shop bit. And it came to my VAT return. I had to pay money for VAT and run out of money. So that's how bad I was at that point. Um, but like, um, like you, you get in and look day one, you think that, you know, they've got the brand and stuff's going to come through the door and it's all going to be fine.

Asad Hamir: It's going to be amazing. You've got this amazing financial model, which shows you how much profit and loss you're going to make over the next two years. And you open, I still remember the first day we had five people to walk through the door, five people. And I sat with the franchise business manager at that point and said, Martin, like, What have I done?

Asad Hamir: Like, you know, are you sure? Is this gonna be okay? And, you know, O2 at the time, I think they saw me as like, um, someone to [00:04:00] take under their wing. And, um, yeah, like, um, next day, um, we ordered a load of banners and really started thinking about marketing and you have to quickly react, right? And, um, yeah. And then within, within the next month, actually the iPhone 3G launch, iPhone 3GS.

Asad Hamir: And that really kick started the business. O2 at that point, they sent us a load of stock. We had more stock than any other store in the country. And if you remember back in the day, uh, when the iPhone had launched, you had queues around the doors and all that kind of stuff. So I think like, you know, listening to your franchisor, working with your franchisor, you know, they're there to support your business.

Asad Hamir: And even from the early days, like even the softer things, right? Like, you know, I was quite, um, uh, yeah, like vulnerable at that point. Right. Cause you started with, you put all your money in, you're 22 years old. Like you don't have that support framework and, um, yeah, like, uh, and then, but then look, you quickly learn and it's a journey, right?

Asad Hamir: Like you're the start of your business journey, right. And you're going to learn all the time, every single. day, [00:05:00] every week, every month. I'm still learning, right? 

Amardeep Parmar: And obviously  you grew that to multiple chains as well. And what was it that made you decide once you had one that was doing well, what was the trigger to be like, yes, I'm ready to do another one.

Amardeep Parmar: How did you make that decision? 

Asad Hamir: There's, there's the analytical answer. Firstly, So, so you've got to, you've got to know your numbers. Yeah. And even if you're not a numbers person, know your numbers, you've got to know your numbers in the franchising business. You've got to really understand your PNL, your stock, like, you know, in a mobile phone business, each phone is worth four or five hundred pounds.

Asad Hamir: Yeah. So if you lose one phone, that's pretty much a profit gone for the day. So really got to control your, your entire PNL. Yeah. So that's the first thing I could see the numbers. I sat down with my cow and I can see the slipstream and see what's profitable. Right. Let's go for the next one. Let's take another risk for another store.

Asad Hamir: This first store was in a retail park. So I was like, okay, let's do the next one in a retail park. Let's get another store, which has the same principles. And then we can do that one. And then maybe third one, I can take a risk and go to a high street. Cause I've not [00:06:00] done that one before. So it was basically looking at those things.

Asad Hamir: The other bit is the feeling. So you start to develop as you get into more and more into business, you start to develop a feeling the sixth sense, right? You get a feeling of this is working, right? And so there's that kind of left, left side brain, right side brain. Um, and then you just got to go for it, right?

Asad Hamir: You've got to like, once you've got that slip stream, you've got to drive it. 

Amardeep Parmar: What advice would you give them? If somebody who's trying to make a decision to get into franchising in the first place. 

Asad Hamir: Yeah. So I've, I've kind of gone full circle. So I actually see things now from a slightly different point of view because I have my own franchise or business.

Asad Hamir: And, um, I've been able to develop a few other businesses along the journey. And, uh, in the early days, I probably didn't respect. The passion that goes into building the brand and the operations manual and all those types of things. Good franchisors embrace that. They embrace the culture of you can fail, you can take risks.

Asad Hamir: And we had that with O2. They wanted us to grow. They wanted us to spread the iPhone left, right and center. [00:07:00] They wanted us to get it into the communities. I really, I really do think that it's really important that you respect the brand. You respect the operations manual. That's there for a reason. It's tried and tested.

Asad Hamir: And look, of course, you're going to have your ideas. Feeding them through the right channels. All those types of things are really important. And a franchisor wants to learn from you, right? Like there's different types of franchising businesses. There's franchising businesses which are fully franchised, and there's ones that are more hybrid.

Asad Hamir: They wanna learn from you, right? So it's about having a really open dialogue with your franchisor. They're there again, I'll say it. They're there to help you build your business. Right. They're there. If you win a good franchise or if you win, they win.

Amardeep Parmar: Can you explain to us, well, as you mentioned there, that you also have franchise owner, so what is that franchise or business and what made you decide to go for that model, for that business?

Asad Hamir: I, I told you guys, I'm, I'm an optometrist. Um, so we have 14 stores in London under a brand called I Emporium. Uh, so it's basically an optician's brand. It's an independent optician brand. So we're kind of trying to be the alternative to spec of [00:08:00] Vision Express. On the high street, providing independent service, uh, you know, better quality eyewear than Specsavers.

Asad Hamir: No, no disrespect for anyone who goes to Specsavers. Um, but yeah, like, um, we, we've actually got two franchisees. So we've been in beta for the last year or so. Uh, we've had, we've had two franchisees and I knew from my franchising experience, there's nothing like a franchisee that's got that hunger. Right.

Asad Hamir: That needs to make this work, right? Because this is their business. If they don't drive it, if they don't smash it, like they ain't going to eat, right? So that's what we got in our first two franchisees. We got people that are really hungry. They knew their industry. They knew their business, of course. Um, and we've proven the model, um, the franchise business now, like both franchisees do double what a normal company own store does.

Asad Hamir: Now in a profitability point of view, and this is always a challenge for a franchise business, probably if I run it myself, I'd probably make a bit more money, but then I'm taking all the risks. Right. So for me in my business, it's about getting that hybrid model. [00:09:00] Yes. In certain schools, I may want to do for my own brand because I need to protect the brand, you know, like build the brand experience.

Asad Hamir: If I'm doing high profile locations, I might not want to do it with a franchisee. You know, my growth strategy is through franchising. 

Amardeep Parmar: And  when you're thinking about franchisees as well, as you said, the hunger and the growth, what else are you looking for in them? Like what makes a good franchisee for a franchisor to work with?

Asad Hamir: I think what's really important and it's the same principle for business in general. And I, I, and when I'm investing in businesses, I look for a few things. A founder who can sell. Yeah. A business person that can sell, you've got to sell and sell is not something that you're born with. You can learn to sell.

Asad Hamir: Yeah. Everyone can learn to sell, right. It's about practice. It's about getting out there and making it happen. So number one, can you sell, can you drive it from the front? It's not about you just employing the manager. You, you being backseat, you've got to be at the front of that business. You've got to be driving things through.

Asad Hamir: Um, so number one, selling number two, um, commercials, you've got to know your numbers. [00:10:00] Yeah. You've got to know that PNL inside out. I can't manage that PNL. If they're not looking after their stock and they're not managing, not managing their costs and all that kind of stuff, they're going to end up in trouble, right?

Asad Hamir: So managing, managing your costs is really, really important. Number three, honesty and integrity are really important as well. So softer things, much harder to test and figure out and all that kind of stuff. And it comes over time, right? Um, but really getting to know the franchisee, really getting to know them, understanding their values, understanding their drivers.

Asad Hamir: Um, you know, ultimately you're building a partnership, right? It's not just a one hit wonder, you know, make money for a couple of years. You want to build a business. That's growing over 10 years and then eventually exit or five years or whatever that period is, right? You want to build not just profit, but enterprise value, right?

Asad Hamir: You want to be able to exit that business. So, you know, to do that, we have to work in partnership. And so that's that honesty, integrity piece. 

Amardeep Parmar:Yeah, I  think that's with any business, right? Whenever you're hiring for any business, it's honestly integrity. But like I said, it's so hard to test. And [00:11:00] when you're looking at people in that sense, right?

Amardeep Parmar: So, what's your process of picking a franchisee? Do you have to interview them? What's that? How does that look like?

Asad Hamir: Like, like, even when I'm interviewing employees, I, I will, I will lead from the front. So it's going to be first interview with myself. Um, you know, make sure that I get that real feel of the individual.

Asad Hamir: So there it's more of a personality thing. You know, are they, uh, you know, are they exciting me? Are they someone that, you know, I can see being someone who's going to drive this business. I don't have the brand of a Specsavers or a Vision Express or someone like that. I'm gonna build it, right? But at the moment, it's about them really being entrepreneurial in their community.

Asad Hamir: So I'm looking for a certain personality type, right? Second, I'm gonna make sure that I put them through analytical tests. Um, you know, test them from that perspective. Um, see them in a, in an environment. Get them into Uh, workspace, you know, spending a day getting them to feel like what it's like, right?

Asad Hamir: And seeing them in action as well. There's no substitute to seeing someone in action. Really easy for someone to, uh, be in an interview and perform, right? And sell [00:12:00] themselves, right? But it's when you actually get to know them and you see them in their real state. That's when you can, you can tell what they're going to be like, not only for your brand, but for the team, right?

Asad Hamir: You're not just recruiting. a franchisee. You're recruiting the people in the business that are going to serve your customers for the brand you're going to build. So, you know, there's the classic kind of, um, higher slowly process, right? And that's the same approach that, you know, we're taking with franchisees, getting to know them, you know, and then, you know, with us, it's about optometry.

Asad Hamir: It's about healthcare. So we're looking for optometrists. We're looking for people with a healthcare background, you know, those kinds of skills as well. 

Amardeep Parmar: So I  know quite well, and I know that in a previous business of yours, you lost millions, right? As you're building that up. And you had the Superman kind of effect of, you did so well at O2, you thought that would then follow on to everything else you did as well.

Amardeep Parmar: So, I'd be interested in knowing as well, this is the beta program, obviously it wouldn't be perfect at the beginning, what mistakes did you find in that program you could then now fix for every other shoe on board? 

Asad Hamir: 100 percent and it's really interesting you ask this because, [00:13:00] and it comes back to this respect for brand building.

Asad Hamir: So O2 did really well, there's a couple other O2 franchisees here actually at the back there and um, you know, we were great at selling, we were great at getting stuff out there. It's very different for you to create a brand. Right. Brand building is a very different skill and the business that I was talking about, I actually lost money because I thought I knew everything.

Asad Hamir: I had those godlike tendencies, you know, you get when you get success at early age. And, um, yeah, like, um, I, I thought I could brand build and I, everything was easy. And I realized that, that at that point I had to learn. And so through that business, I learned how to brand build off the back of that. We've gone into other businesses.

Asad Hamir: We've got now a portfolio of businesses. And yeah, like, you know, everything's a journey, right? And that's the thing, right? With franchising as well. There's no guarantee of success, right? At the end of the day, you're taking a risk, right? It's for you to make it happen, right? And you to make sure that you do your research, your due diligence, [00:14:00] you're really thorough.

Asad Hamir: You know, of course, there's an emotional element of this. Like you have to want to go into that business, but make sure you take that analytical commercial viewpoint on, on the franchise business, really study the numbers. Really make sure that you spend time in a franchise business. Really make sure that you've lived and breathed that business.

Asad Hamir: When you walk in, it's a calculated risk. You're 90 percent sure. If you're not 90 percent sure, then there's a problem in my view. 

Amardeep Parmar: Hey everyone. I hope you're enjoying this episode so far. The Bae HQ has a podcast, but we're so much more than that. So if you want to find out about all the events we've got going on, all the different ways you can meet each other, as well as resources.

Amardeep Parmar: to help you build the business of your dreams. Then check out the link in the show notes, sign up to our newsletter, where you get a weekly roundup, which we like to call the BAE Letter, that will keep you in the loop. If you want to help us out, the best thing you can possibly do is sign up to our newsletter and share it with your friends.

Amardeep Parmar: So that's enough for me. Now, let's get back to the [00:15:00] show.

Amardeep Parmar: Yeah. And  now like, what's the plans for the future now? Right. So you've been, you've done your beta, you know, you've proven the model. Where do you want to now get 

Asad Hamir: to? What's the growth plan? So we've got Salim actually in the background there. He's the founder of the business.

Asad Hamir: Salim give us a wave. So, um, so Salim is actually going to be driving. So he's the founder of iEmporium. We backed him, uh, and what he's doing for the business. It's growth. It's about growth and it's about building, uh, like an amazing brand. Right. And then independent brand that, you know, is the best alternative, not even the best alternative, the number one choice for you when you search on Google for opticians in your local area.

Asad Hamir: And we want to spread this. And for us, the target is London and Southeast. That's the key priority for us. Like we want to own it in this area. Um, we know the area where London boys, you know, like this is our playground. Um, and then we'll see, right. 

Amardeep Parmar: And looking at that. So how are you going to scale that model?

Amardeep Parmar: Because they said it's so hard to find the right people. And it said about hiring slowly. How do you then, [00:16:00] if you want to grow fast, how do you grow fast while also hiring slow? 

Asad Hamir: So I have the beauty of a fantastic founder who's very well networked in the optometry space. So I think network is your network, right?

Asad Hamir: So network, network, network. I think that is key. Getting to know people before you know them, right, is really important. Building that network is going to be really important for us. We really understand that person before we meet them. Um, and then handpicking them. You know, what's key is like, you know, we need to really go for those individuals.

Asad Hamir: You know, it's about the quality, not the quantity at this stage. We know that once we hit that tipping point, it will scale. And it's, you know, it's not pushing that, right, slipstream will happen. You don't force it, right? It's something I've learned over the years. Once you hit that slipstream, you know, it's there.

Asad Hamir: Then you go. Don't ever force that thing. 

Amardeep Parmar: What are some of the  problems you think that might be coming up in the future and how are you trying to make sure or mitigate 

Asad Hamir: it and prepare for those problems? For us now, it's um, it's those choices that we, where we go as a brand. What locations we go [00:17:00] into, whether they're the right fit for us.

Asad Hamir: And we're just using lots of data. So data is king, right? So what is the data of existing business? Tell us where do we want to go? What locations? Uh, who's the right fit franchisee? Um, you know, lead with data, use the data. Of course, you need to go there as a retailer. I had to be able to feel the energy, walk the high street, go into the stores, you know, get a feel of our competitors, all those types of things.

Asad Hamir: But, uh, yeah, like it's, um, I think, you know, over the years you do get this kind of sixth sense. Um, but you know, the final thing I say is build your network around. You've got to talk to people on that journey. Yeah. So make friends with fellow franchisees on that journey. Make friends with people outside franchising, build your network there, share your problems.

Asad Hamir: You know, it's so, so important. The mistakes I made in the past. I was like, no, I'll sort it out. I'll, I'll get it done. No, you need to share with other people. You need to share your problems so that you can then learn from other people's experience. 

Amardeep Parmar: Yeah. And I think it's a big important part about today, right?

Amardeep Parmar: It's [00:18:00] that people can see your mistakes, what you've done wrong and not just copy that obviously, because then it's very easy. Like you said, for people to think, Oh, here's somebody got successful without seeing all the different things along the way that maybe didn't work out. People who are watching this as well might notice that it’s got  quite a different set of glasses to what you might have seen other people, right? 

Amardeep Parmar:  How much of that is also been designed thinking filtering into the franchise as well and having that different lens of looking at things? 

Asad Hamir: Yeah, definitely.  I think, you know, with, with with, with store design and store experiences, you know, there's a real art to it. Whether it's like the lighting and how lights can fall onto objects and make them look different. Um, whether it's how, you know, with our products, Glasses are, um, you know, really, really small items, right?

Asad Hamir: And so you have to really make them stand out. How do you enhance your customer experience using design, right? So design is a really powerful tool, uh, if used properly, right? But also you have to be really smart with design. Design can be a super expensive process. So, um, yeah, like, you know, I spent ages talking about this, but, um, yeah, design is really important.

Asad Hamir: Not just designing [00:20:00] the store, the accessories, the, the whole thing, you know, it's got to be, you know, that's what people want these days. They want an experience. 

Amardeep Parmar: Is there anything that you may be undervalued at the start of this journey when you started the first like beta testing, but then through that beta testing, you realize that actually really important to onboard other franchises in the future to make sure that they're set up for success.

Asad Hamir: I think one, one of the big things is creating the support framework for the franchisee, right? Um, so making sure that they are listened to. Making sure that, you know, their ideas, you know, ultimately, they are like your employees in a way, right? Like they are that, you know, they are people that need to feel that energy and that love from you, right?

Asad Hamir: And that is something that, you know, maybe in the early days, you know, like, you know, we need to make sure that we Uh, really create that support framework and it's hard right when you're when you're starting a new franchise brand, it's difficult to invest in this and invest in that and you know, and it's about taking the franchisee on that journey and what's really important.

Asad Hamir: I think [00:21:00] it's for franchisees is making them feel like they're part of your business and part of that growth. Um, so that's, I'd say is definitely one of the layers. 

Amardeep Parmar: So  I'm going to ask the audience for questions in a second. So if you've got an idea, start getting ready to do that as well. So final question from me is going to be what's the thing that you enjoy the most about being both a franchisee and a franchisor?

Asad Hamir: The people. The people is the thing that, you know, is, is, you know, forget the brand, forget all the exciting stuff, the cool glasses, whatever. It's about people at the end of the day, right? Like you're managing. Franchisees, inspiring them, getting the motivated, um, you know, then you're managing through them into the teams in store.

Asad Hamir: It's about leadership. It's about, you know, excitement, creating the energy, creating the buzz. That's the most important thing, you know? And, um, yeah, like that's what I love. Right. And look, then if you manage that, everything else becomes easy. Yeah. The numbers become easy. The marketing becomes easy.

Asad Hamir: Everything becomes easy because you're able to inspire other people, right. You know, do what, you know, you don't need to [00:22:00] do everything as the, as a business owner, right? Um, you need to be able to delegate and let them, uh, drive it. 

Amardeep Parmar: So,  thanks so much for that. And some of you might have noticed, like, obviously, Asad is a very good speaker and he actually won Dragon's Den with one of his other companies as well.

Amardeep Parmar: So it gives you an idea of the kind of charisma and how, obviously, that helps you to inspire people in the future as well. Do you have any questions from the audience? 

Amardeep Parmar:  So, The audience member asked about how, what assets

Amardeep Parmar: personal brand is on, how that helps him in terms of inspiring his franchisees and creating that relationship.

Asad Hamir: It's so interesting you asked that question because, so my Instagram, I do for one, actually two reasons. Okay. Number one for my son and my, my daughter just to see it and like follow my journey and stuff. Number two for my team. Yeah. That is what my Instagram is for. Yeah, for them to see what I'm doing every single day, they see my energy, they see what I'm doing, and that inspires them.

Asad Hamir: Yeah, LinkedIn is slightly different, that has a slightly different purpose. But 100 percent like personal brand and using social media channels. And if [00:23:00] you're, you know, conversation, you should be having a franchise franchisors here is are you embracing franchisees to be able to use their personal social media brands?

Asad Hamir: Locally, because man, you can build like businesses locally, like crazy. You know, my first business, the, the O2 stuff, I built the first store through networks, and now we have the power of Instagram, Facebook, Tiktok. Um, so yeah, look, it's so important for you to create that culture. ‘Cause you know, when you're not there, when you would do it going from one site to five sites to 10 sites.

Asad Hamir: That's what you want to do, right? How do you be everywhere? You can't, right? And that culture needs to be effervescent through the company, right? And ultimately, you need to be able to someday remove yourself from the business, bring the MD in or bring the operations director in or whatever it is, right?

Asad Hamir: But that culture still needs to be there. So I Highly recommend everyone, like, you know, start build, build on social, even from the beginning, share the journey, share the story. Ultimately, your customers will get attracted to it as well. So, yeah. [00:24:00] 

Amardeep Parmar: The audience member there asked about how, can you outsource some of the design building into her personal brand?

Amardeep Parmar: Because it's very difficult, obviously, for many business owners to do that at the same time as building the company and managing their staff.

Asad Hamir: Is that just like selling, you can't outsource, you can't outsource that customer journey piece. And you can't outsource that, that design, like, um, inspo, like, look, you can definitely give a brief to a design agency and go, look, this is the problem I'm trying to solve.

Asad Hamir: Right. But ultimately you've got to control the experience. Problem with design agencies and no disrespect to design agencies is if you give them too wide a canvas to work with, they don't know where to go, right? So you have to be really tight with that brief. What is it that you're trying to solve, right?

Asad Hamir: So for me personally, we, me and Salim love the design piece. We'll, we'll get intimately involved in every step. You know, the design agency is driving that process as well. They're project managing it. [00:25:00] Um, you know, like personally, you know, free experience we've learned over the years to know what we want.

Asad Hamir: Um, so it depends where you are on that journey as well. Right. And, and there are different types of agencies with different things as well. So I would say there's also a best fit. There's not one best fit agency. So the agency that might be good for you on day one, which gives you the ideas is probably not the best one for you on that journey where you just got to like execute again and again and again, right?

Asad Hamir: So yeah, happy to have a chat after as well. 

Amardeep Parmar: So he asked there, did you have any major losses and what caused that?

Asad Hamir: I had several, several along the journey and, um, what I've become better at is minimizing the losses. The first one was a really big one. I lost a few million pounds. Um, and, and it was putting good money into bad.

Asad Hamir: You know, like classic stuff, like, you know, just kept on putting money and thinking it's gonna turn around. It's gonna turn around. It's gonna turn around. Never did. Right. And, um, and then at some point my mentor at the time says, [00:26:00] you've got to, you've got to kill this. Otherwise it's going to kill you.

Asad Hamir: Right. And, um, so. Yeah, like, you know, and there's lots of reasons, lots of things that were not quite right product market fit, uh, you know, imbalance of stock and, you know, needing to buy too much stock to make the business work and lots of like warning signs. But when you're in the heat of the battle, sometimes you're not.

Asad Hamir: You know, seeing those, you need that outside perspective again. It comes back to like creating that support framework around you. Um, now those losses are minimized. So I've had loads of like mini failures on that journey. Probably like, you know, yeah, loads, but like now I've learned like when to cut it right and how to structure it.

Asad Hamir: And, you know, and. It's a constant process. You've got to make sure those losses are minimized and you know that, you know, making sure the minimize also how you legally structure your business, making sure you, you know, have the, you know, create a limited company, make sure that, [00:27:00] you know, you're getting all your invoices, you're, you know, putting all the kind of regulatory things in place, the frameworks in place so that if we do need to fold the business, you know, you've got that framework in place that it doesn't kill you, right?

Asad Hamir: Like pgs don't take pgs. Like, you know, one of the things I, you know, took a PG once and I never will do it again, right? Don't personally take liability. That's the beauty of this country. There's something called limited liability, right? You don't need to personally take risk, right? This country encourages entrepreneurship, right?

Asad Hamir: Um, of course, it's about making sure that You know, your business idea, you set it up to succeed, right? You know, you've got to make sure you don't personally take risks because it's a journey you're going to go on entrepreneurship. Right. 

Amardeep Parmar: So thanks so much for that question. And thanks so much, Assad. I think we've run out of time now.

Amardeep Parmar: So we're going to stop there, but if anybody wants to ask any more questions, I think he's not getting off too quickly. So come up on stage and asking questions as well. So thanks again so much, everybody. And thanks Asad for coming on.[00:28:00] 

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